A Bull's Thoughts On Desirable Traits For COuples

[athlete915]

All,

I recently discovered this website and have been generally impressed with the quality of the writing and discourse. Like many of you, I have found that to be rare.

To contribute a little to the discourse and offer a different perspective, I wanted to share what I look for in couples. I have over a decade of experience with being with couples as a bull (though when I got started, I didn’t even know that term existed). As will probably be evident from what I am about to share, I prefer long-term, steady relationships with my couples. My views certainly don’t reflect those of all bulls, but I thought you all may find some value in the perspective.

So, without further ado, here are some thoughts (roughly prioritized):

Aesthetics: Maybe shallow by other societal standards, but the wife’s attractiveness is the starting point for determining whether I want to pursue things with a couple. It’s common for many wives to have spent years prioritizing their families and careers over their looks, so I am not expecting supermodels. Still, I am also not going to lower my standards to be with a wife/couple.

One of the many side benefits of getting involved in the lifestyle is that it often encourages the wives, and even husbands, to improve their fitness, diet, and looks (the same goes for bulls). There’s nothing like spending more time nude… with an audience… to motivate you to workout a little more and watch what you eat. You will find many a cuckold who will say that their wives became even more sexy and beautiful than they were when they first met.

Healthy Marriages: Getting involved in the lifestyle will enhance otherwise happy marriages, it won’t save unhappy marriages. So, when I am meeting new couples, I want to see that they love and care about each other. That they have good communication. All the fun sex in the world isn’t going to save a relationship if it doesn’t have strong fundamentals. It certainly isn’t fun to be a third member of an unhappy marriage. The flip side is that getting involved in the lifestyle can help happy relationships get even better. It encourages honesty and communication. It relieves stress and comes with a lot of pleasure and excitement.

Mutual Interest: I won’t get involved with a couple if I get the sense that one of them really wants to do it, while the other feels forced to do it. While most couples begin their exploration after one of them suggests the idea, by the time they actually go through with it there should be mutual interest from both of them, even if it isn’t always equal. Some of you may be thinking, “Well, they just need to try it once,” but the truth is that great sex can’t happen if someone isn’t into it. The couple should either keep talking about it until more interest emerges or they should pursue other activities.

I’m saying this to the guys in the audience, no matter how excited you are, don’t rush your wife. Be encouraging and supportive but do things at the pace of her comfort, not the pace of your fantasies. If you rush her, I almost guarantee you that things will go poorly. If things go poorly, you’re never going to get to explore your fantasies. On the other hand, if those first steps go well, they will likely lead to further steps and exploration. That’s when the true fun really occurs. So again, take a deep breath, keep yourself under control, and be the wonderful, patient cuckold that you want to be.

Personality: While aesthetics and sexual chemistry certainly matter, guess what, you’re eventually going to have to talk to one another. If the husband and I can’t enjoy watching a game with a beer or the wife and I can’t enjoy a date together, the relationship isn’t going to workout. The fun thing though is when you click on a personal level, it only enhances the bedroom play.

Supportive Husbands: You don’t want to find yourself in a situation where there are “too many chiefs and not enough Indians.” While there is a strong correlation between husbands who want to share and submissive tendencies, you will occasionally encounter husbands who can’t sit back and relax. They want to direct things. Often it is the husbands who have high-level jobs and have never explored their sub sides. I’ll remind them that they have invited me into their relationship because of my skills, abilities, and abilities, so they should let me maximize those traits. Usually, a session or two is enough to help them experience the benefits and joy of not having to be the one in control.

Relationship Interest: One-night stands are fun, but honestly the best sex couples once a couple has explored one another, discovered likes, and dislikes, and tried new things together. You also need to develop trust and comfort. All of that takes time. So while I certainly understand why some couples prefer one-nighters, I prefer couples who are at least open to the idea of developing something more long-term.

Availability: As can be imagined, I have a very strong sex drive. While I understand that couples have plenty of other things in their lives, I look for couples who are interested and available to meet on a steady basis. What exactly steady is depends on the couple and other circumstances, like whether she and I are also playing alone. I’d say every week or two is good. Once a month is probably a stretch. Of course, I would happily fuck the wife every day if that’s an option…

Proximity: While I will do long-distance relationships with former couples, you can’t really develop a steady relationship with a couple who is relatively close (< 2-hour drive).

I’ll wrap things up with some “nice to haves” (vice “must haves”). I’m single, own my home, and couldn’t care less if my neighbors have any concerns about my lifestyle, so I am always happy to have my couples over. I know my place can be a refuge and where they can open ip. At the same time, it is nice when my couples can (eventually) host too. Few couples are ready to do that right off the bat, but as the relationship develops and you build that trust and comfort, it often becomes an option. I also enjoy couples who like to travel. That’s where the wife and I can be open about our relationship and enjoy the freedom that comes with it. Finally, while I am not looking for a sugar couple, it is nice when couples have the freedom that couples with financial stability. That enables things like travel.

One thing I didn’t mention was experience. I’ve had inexperienced and experienced couples. Both have their benefits. Experienced couples are easier because they have worked through some of the initial emotions and generally know what they are looking for. Inexperienced couples are more challenging, but it is also incredibly rewarding to help a new couple get started. I just know that I will need to take my time and not rush them.

Anyway, that’s my two cents. Thanks for letting me share and let me know if you have any questions or comments. I’ll try to get to them when I have time.

Good luck and play safe.

[Smallcock74]

My wife and I have been living this lifestyle for almost ten years. You make it sound like there are only a few potential bulls for every ten or twenty cuckold couples when in actual fact there are hundreds upon hundreds of potential bulls per cuckold couple and therefore it's the wife who chooses the bull and not as you seem to suggest.

[athlete915]

That wasn’t my intention. A willing woman will always have way more suitors than any man. I don’t care how handsome/talented the guy is. With the said, that doesn’t mean that the men seeking couples can’t have standards of their own. Frankly, I would be weary of any who didn’t. I just wanted to offer my perspective in that regard.

[Seductionrules]

Thank you for your interesting perspective.

[philip504]

Very good summary

[armyguyot1]

Welcome to the forum philip504.

[bowlerlb]

I think a very good outline of what it is about.

[athlete915]

Very good summary

Thank you, Philip!

[athlete915]

I think a very good outline of what it is about.

Thank you, Bowler!

[Teensy1]

Quite thoughtful indeed. Many thanks.

[trecital]

Just some curiosity questions for you. You say you have over a decade of experience being a bull to "couples", plural.
So, let's say 12ish years, and at least two couples.
Could you tell me, is your bull relationship your only sex life? By which I mean, do you have a wife or girlfriend of your own? Have you ever had a wife or girlfriend?
What age are you? Are you a bull to only one couple at a time, or to more than one? How do you find these couples? Do you advertise in some way? Scour social media or dating sites? Contact people on forums like this?
I imagine that most 'bulls' are 'accidental', by which I mean that they never set out to be a bull. They were just the 'third' person....a friend, work colleague or whoever. But you seem to be saying that being a 'bull' is something you actively seek to be. So I'm curious as to how that works.
I've other questions, but they would depend on your answers to what I've already asked.
And, to clarify, my questions are from genuine curiosity. Thanks.

[athlete915]

And, to clarify, my questions are from genuine curiosity. Thanks.

No, thank you. These are great questions and I am happy to do my best to answer them. Furthermore, it's always been my experience that if someone has a question, usually others do as well, so you're probably helping someone else out by asking them.

I'm going to answer your questions a bit out of order, so bear with me:

What age are you? I'm in my early 30s

Have you ever had a wife or girlfriend? While I have never been married, I have had plenty of conventional dating relationships with girlfriends. I would be shocked to find out that someone's first relationship and subsequent relationships had only been with couples, but of course, the world is a surprising place, so it may have happened. Certainly not me though.

Is your bull relationship your only sex life? No, as mentioned, I also date single women as well.

Are you a bull to only one couple at a time, or to more than one? As I mentioned in my original post, I prefer long-term, steady relationships with my couples. My experience is that you can't have multiple relationships like that at a time. You're just spread too thin. It's not fair to the couple(s). It's also stressful for you. So, usually, it is just one couple at a time.

How do you find these couples? That's hard to answer because in my personal experience, there hasn't been a consistent pattern. For example, my first two couples started with friendships between the boyfriend/husband and me. My next couple was an experienced lifestyle couple who I met through an adult dating website.

I imagine that most 'bulls' are 'accidental', by which I mean that they never set out to be a bull. There's a lot to unpack here. My first experience with a couple was definitely accidental. I had zero clue that terms like bull, cuck, etc., or the lifestyle existed. As you mentioned, I was a third for what we thought was going to be a threesome (where we subsequently found that the boyfriend preferred watching to actively participating). It wasn't until I was with my second couple that I discovered other couples did things like this and that there were terms related to it.

Those experiences taught me that I was comfortable being with couples and enjoyed the unique dynamic. It was only then that I really started seeking out couples.

I will say though that you will find inexperienced guys who are interested in being with couples and actively seek them out (vice the accidental third approach). That's not to say that things always worked out as they fantasized about when they actually tried a couple.

Thanks again for the great questions and please let me know if you have any more.

[trecital]

Thanks, that adds some interesting background to what you've already said. And is something along the lines of what I had assumed. I don't want to hog the conversation here, but I assume that you've posted in the Cuckold Forum, because the relationships you've had, have had a cuckold dynamic to them, rather than a more 'hotwifey' one, if that makes sense.

So, couple more questions. Do you enjoy being the dominant male? Ok, might seem obvious, but I'm really asking for more than a simple yes or no answer ( or almost certainly a yes answer). Maybe you could give some background as to how you arrived at wanting to be the 'dominant' one.

Also, inevitably,, I'd be interested to hear how you like to treat the cuck. What would be your ideal situation? Also, any examples of how things were with the couples you've been with, Vis a vis cuckolding?

[humiliation]

Excellent follow up Trecital!

[athlete915]

I don't want to hog the conversation here

Don't worry about that. Your questions have been great and you can already read that at least one other member appreciated you asking them.

Do you enjoy being the dominant male? Short answer, yes.

Maybe you could give some background as to how you arrived at wanting to be the 'dominant' one. Longer answer I would say that it developed along two complimentary tracks. First, in my first sexual experiences with women, I found that I was pretty good in the bedroom. That in turn gave me confidence and aggressiveness. I found that women responded well to that and enjoyed it when I took control in the bedroom. In return, I found that I enjoyed that role and it came naturally to me.

The second track was when I ended up with the first couple. As I alluded to, we all went into it with the expectation that it was going to be a more traditional threesome, with him and I playing equal parts. Well, what I noticed pretty quickly was that he was sitting back more and watching. At first, I thought that maybe he wasn't enjoying himself and I tried giving him some opportunity to get more involved. He didn't take them. Eventually, I stopped trying and focused on pleasing her. I thought that it was a one-time thing, but they invited me back a couple of weeks later. Once again, I found the same pattern happened. Once things got going, he sat back and took a more passive role. He didn't seem upset and never took any opening to get more involved, so again, I just focused on taking care of her. By the third time, there was no doubt that he preferred sitting back. I didn't necessarily understand his motivation, especially in those early sessions, but I was confident that was what he wanted.

Later, when I got involved with my second couple, the husband acted the same way. He was just as happy when I was taking the lead and he could play a supporting role. Eventually, I started asking him to help get her ready for our dates/times together and he was super eager to do so. He clearly liked it when I gave him direction. When I told him that he had done a good job, he would smile from ear to ear.

During one particularly hot session, he ended up going down on her after I had finished. When he and I discussed it later, he said he didn't know why he did it, but something having watched us and seen her pussy look like that just drove him nuts and he did it without really thinking about it. Once he had done it two or three more times, it started to become a steady part of our play. That seemed to really reinforce the power dynamic between us.

The experiences with those first two couples taught me that some men have submissive sides. While I preferred to be the one in charge and loved pleasing the wife, they were happiest playing supportive roles and watching her be pleasured. I felt like our two natures complemented one another. Their girlfriend and wife definitely benefited from it.

What would be your ideal situation? Each cuck, wife, and couple is different, so I try to avoid taking a cookie-cutter approach. My role as the bull is to help them explore their desires on an individual level and as a couple. That takes time. At first, you need to build trust and comfort. Next, you need to get to know their wants, needs, and desires. What do they like? What don't they like? What would they like to explore? I can also use that time to talk to them about the things that I have done with my other couples and offer suggestions. That all allows me to tailor my approach and actions to best meet those desired ends (and avoid mistakes).

In my experience (so take it with a grain of salt), one of the biggest things for cucks is not feeling like an awkward third wheel. Their focus is on allowing their wives to have as much pleasure as possible, but they wonder how they fit into all of that, especially since they aren't the ones directly providing them that pleasure. As mentioned with my second couple, I found that cucks love to given opportunities to help support the relationship by helping her get ready for our sessions (e.g., helping her pick out outfits) and then taking care of her afterward (e.g., cleaning). It helps them feel useful and connected to the relationship. I think many are surprised by the sense of pride they get when I compliment them on their support. That's when they first grasp that they are not only submissive to their wives, but also to me as their bulls.

Along those lines, I like to develop relationships with the cuckolds. While both of our focus is on their wives, the better we get along, the better the overall relationship will go. Once I am involved with a couple, I will open up regular communication with the cuck. I'll use those talks to plan the next get-togethers, give them ideas on how to help prepare for them, and just get to know them. The cucks will often open not only about their thoughts but also offer me insights into their wives. Remember, they know their wives way better than I do, so I can learn a lot from them and benefit from that insider information.

It can be a ton of fun to go grab beers and watch a game with a husband. Everyone around us just sees two guys talking over a beer. Meanwhile, he and I are discussing what I am going to do to his wife the next time I can have her. Meanwhile, she's at home wondering what we are talking about and getting excited to think about what we are planning.

Obviously, there is so much more to these relationships and again, they're all different in their own way. In the end, if the wife is pleasured, she'll want to play more. if she feels like she has the support of her husband, she'll feel like she has the freedom to play more. If the husband is enjoying himself, he'll be more supportive of his wife. It all feeds on each other in a positive loop.

[Aynsley]

Thank You athlete915 !!
IMHO, there are not enough Bull
contributions & perspectives on OHW.

And, from my 14yrs in the LS, I’d opine
your approach is spot-on.

Question:
Given your age, what’s your view on the
age of potential cuck-couples ?
(ie- ideal as well as upper limit)

[bowlerlb]

I enjoyed the read and agree with your approach. I always like to get cuck hubby involved so that he has some tasks to help with her pleasure. It is his role to arrange the sessions and help her to dress and groom. I always liked him to prepare my cock for entry, lubed and ready to penetrate as he guides it into her, and of course clean up all cum from cock and pussy and body after I finish. Love hearing them discuss how I tasted today.

[trecital]

Obviously, there is so much more to these relationships and again, they're all different in their own way. In the end, if the wife is pleasured, she'll want to play more. if she feels like she has the support of her husband, she'll feel like she has the freedom to play more. If the husband is enjoying himself, he'll be more supportive of his wife. It all feeds on each other in a positive loop.

I particularly relate to this paragraph. There have been 'bulls' on here before, whose attitude has come across as 'my way, or the highway'. Maybe that has an appeal for somebody who feels they are, or need to be, very submissive.
But, I would suggest, this agressive approach is soon going to run into trouble when the wife or the cuck realises that they aren't getting what they anticipated or wanted out of the relationship.
It's my belief that the Cuck/Wife/Bull relationship is always a complicated 'dance', especially at the beginning. It's essential that everyone is getting the maximum possible from the situation. I get the impression from some 'bulls' that their main purpose is to try and sideline the cuck, and get as much of the wife's pussy as possible. Fine if that's what the cuck wants. But I would suggest that most cucks want to be included and want to have their needs met, as far as is reasonably possible.

So, it's refreshing to hear you talk about finding out about everyone's needs and desires. And let's not forget that the bull has his own wants. He's not there to just satisfy the cucks fantasies.

Great post.

[Tryagain]

First, that is great advice you provided.

Since you seem to want to understand a lot about the couples before moving ahead, including whether they seem to have a happy marriage, how many times generally do you meet with either them or just the wife, before you engage in sex?

You indicate you would like sex with her 1x a week or at most once a month. That seems to be ambitious considering work and family and life in general keeps many folks busy and unavailable. What percent of couples have been that available to you?

Do you ever engage in sex with them after a brief first meeting – not same day but at the second meeting?

Are you okay with couples who just want sex and not much of anything else outside the bedroom?

I am so curious to know how you develop a relationship with the husband – and the couple as well -outside the bedroom? Does that matter to you?

And last but not least, are you well-hung? How often to husbands want to give oral to you – and do you allow that?

[athlete915]

Question:
Given your age, what’s your view on the
age of potential cuck-couples ?
(ie- ideal as well as upper limit)

Thank you for the feedback and question. I really appreciate them.

To answer your question, in my 20s my upper limit was probably upper 40s. In my 30s that has evolved into 50s.

Age matters a whole lot less than looks, fitness, personality, and the couple’s relationship. I know women on their 40s who have bodies that women in their 20s would die for, so age just isn’t that big of a determining factor.

[athlete915]

First, that is great advice you provided.

Thank you. I hope it was at least interesting, if not useful.

How many times generally do you meet with either them or just the wife, before you engage in sex? That's really variable and completely depends on the couple. Some couples prefer a lot of in-person vetting, while others are comfortable moving forward faster if the distance vetting went well.

What percent of couples have been that available to you? With the majority of my couples, the frequency usually started at the slower every several weeks or once-a-month pace. As the relationship develops and we build trust and comfort, along with an understanding of each other's schedules, that's when the frequency picks up. I would say that almost all of my long-term couples eventually reached the point where we were seeing each other at least every week or two.

Do you ever engage in sex with them after a brief first meeting – not same day but at the second meeting? Yes, but only after extensive distance vetting (i.e., phone calls, texts, emails, etc.)

Are you okay with couples who just want sex and not much of anything else outside the bedroom? In theory yes, but in my experience, that's not how it works in practice. You can't really be in a long-term, steady relationship with someone and not have it evolve into something other than just sex.

I am so curious to know how you develop a relationship with the husband – and the couple as well -outside the bedroom? Does that matter to you? It does matter to me. Having a good relationship outside of the bedroom contributes to a good relationship in the bedroom. In simple terms, if they like you outside of the bedroom, they're going to want to spend more time with you in the bedroom.

Developing the relationship is very similar to developing any other friendship. Usually, the cucks are excited, if not surprised, that I show interest in them beyond what is required to sleep with their wives. The conversations usually start focused on the sexual relationship (How are you enjoying things? What do you like about it? What can we do better?), but it eventually begins to resemble the conversation between two friends (sports, weather, work, hobbies).

And last but not least, are you well-hung? How often to husbands want to give oral to you – and do you allow that? Yes, I am. I would say about a quarter to a third express an interest in giving me oral. I do not allow it though. The idea of being sucked by a man just doesn't do anything for me. There are certainly plenty of bi bulls out there who enjoy it, but sadly for my bi cucks, I am not one of them.

[usuallylost]

Thank you so much for posting your insights, athlete. It is nice to hear a bull's perspective and I appreciate you answering questions which I have a few of. My wife and I enjoy having me wear lingerie at times and being submissive to her. I am only a wannabe at this point, but hope to have that change some day, but I am curious though, have any of the couples you have been with gotten into humiliation of the husband or boyfriend? If so, do you enjoy that type of play? Does having the husband submit to you or be humiliated by you seem to turn on the wife? I would think this type of play is always desired by the husband in couples that like this, but have any of the wives ever initiated this type of play?

Did any of the couples enjoy having a submissive husband dress in lingerie? You mentioned that you do not allow the husband suck you so just wondering if dressing in lingerie is off limits too.

Thank you so much for your comments. And Merry Christmas.

[athlete915]

Thank you so much for posting your insights, athlete. It is nice to hear a bull's perspective and I appreciate you answering questions which I have a few of.

My pleasure! Thanks for the feedback.

Have any of the couples you have been with gotten into humiliation of the husband or boyfriend? Yes. It's pretty common with submissive husbands/boyfriends for there to be some humiliation/teasing play.

If so, do you enjoy that type of play? I do as long as it is done with pleasure in mind. Some people get off on being humiliated and teased, and if that is the case, I am all for it (within certain boundaries). But if the subs don't find pleasure in it, it does nothing for me. Does that make sense?

Does having the husband submit to you or be humiliated by you seem to turn on the wife? At first, most wives aren't sure if their husbands enjoy it or not. If they see that they enjoy submitting and being humiliated, it will excite them. If not, they'll be protective of their husbands and it will be a huge turn-off.

One side note is that one offshoot of dominating the husband is that it usually increases the wife's submissive feelings for me. If I can dominate her husband, that makes me seem that much more powerful and masculine.

I would think this type of play is always desired by the husband in couples that like this, but have any of the wives ever initiated this type of play? I'm sure it does happen, but in my personal experience, the wife's love for her husband usually makes her cautious about dominating him and especially humiliating him.

Did any of the couples enjoy having a submissive husband dress in lingerie? Some have, to varying degrees. On the low-end side of the scale, I have had my husband get excited when I set them out of the house (i.e., to work) with a pair of her dirty panties in his pocket. A little reminder of what we've done, while he is out in the "real world." Others have worn panties or other types of lingerie.

You mentioned that you do not allow the husband suck you so just wondering if dressing in lingerie is off limits too. No, it's not off-limits. Having a husband suck me is a direct sexual experience between us and again, it just doesn't do anything for me. If my cucks enjoy wearing lingerie, I'm all for it.

I hope those answers help. Please feel free to keep the questions coming and good luck with your own journey.

[trecital]

I have to say, that this is the first time, in all the years of reading on this forum, that a bull has come across as someone who actually thinks about what the cuck and the wife/girlfriend want from the relationship.
I can only ever remember (before 'athlete915') self confessed bulls who, overtly or subtlety, were only really interested in fucking someone else's wife, and bolstering their own ego.

I am not suggesting that 'athlete915' has no self interest, and no agenda of his own. After all, he needs to get something from the relationship. But he clearly understands that the better he satisfies, within reason, the cuck and the wife, the more he can satisfy his own needs.

So, thank you, 'athlete915', for your long and considered replies to people's questions. I hope you will continue to maintain a presence here, and give us an insight into what a good bull thinks.

A question I do have is, what is your motivation in being a bull. Do you expect recompense, in any way? And even if you don't, do any of your couples offer you anything?

[usuallylost]

althlete, not sure how to attach a reply to your message, but yes, your answers are very helpful and I, like trecital, appreciate your insights. I am not sure if it is of interest in the group here, but to answer a question/comment you had, I had cuckold tendencies since I was in my 20's so I never questioned why a man would want to see his woman with another. I almost got to watch a girlfriend back then fuck another man, but it didn't happen. But you are absolutely correct, in my marriage I quickly went from being curious as to what my wife would think to oh my goodness I can think of no other fantasy. Now, decades later, it is a constant thought. Although my wife does not play with others, she has bumped up the teasing and denial. She still feels sorry for me when I haven't cum in awhile, but we are going out of town tomorrow and she hasn't let me cum for awhile in preparation for the hotel and her new vibrator, the We-Vibe Chorus. I also love wearing lingerie and she has told me that if she ever does play with another, I will be dressed in lingerie and only get to watch. I cannot get that thought out of my head and this fantasy has played out with particular friends in my head including a couple I have known since high school. Today she told me that I will wear a sort of long line corset type bra and panties while we go shopping out of town tomorrow and that I cannot cum tonight, nor the week. I know that is very tame for those that go long periods with no orgasm, but anything over a week is a long time for us and she enjoys the teasing when I get that horny. Tomorrow will be a week. I realize this is very tame and probably boring to many here, but this works for now for us.

I do have a question which you may have mentioned and, if so, my apologies for the repeat. Where do you meet most of the couples you play with? Online, bars, or somewhere in particular near you? Do you usually get to know or introduce yourself to the wife first or meet the couple together? Have you ever had a situation where you and the wife were onboard and she had to convince her hubby to play? Have you ever been to a sex club with a couple? You mentioned you prefer to play with only one couple at a time, but what is the longest you have played with the same couple?

Again, thank you for taking the time to share.