Hotwife going out alone/why is it too difficult for me?

[mrs_reese]

So Jake went without me all weekend.
I texted him and told him I’m
Coming over for lunch time with new lingerie and a winter coat. I’m craving his yummy body.
We’ll see how he adapts to less time with me

[zoe]

The most complex but least complicated situation… we met 2 couples on vacation where the wives were best friends and intense lovers who shared their husbands and based upon the desire de jour would enjoy FF, MFM, or FMF with each other. All 4 were committed to providing what the others needed

Hubby and I talked about going to a couples resort, after Jake wanted to take me and I didn’t feel comfortable going with him.

Zoe is my wife, but yes
We will meet you there

You’d enjoy me Zoe

[mrs_reese]

Hubby and I talked about going to a couples resort, after Jake wanted to take me and I didn’t feel comfortable going with him.

Zoe is my wife, but yes
We will meet you there

You’d enjoy me Zoe

I am sorry- I meant you’d enjoy me

[Open2it]

I’m sure a good time would be had by all!

[zoe]

Zoe is my wife, but yes
We will meet you there

You’d enjoy me Zoe

I am sorry- I meant you’d enjoy me

Hopefully that would be a two way street

[mrs_reese]

Just checking in, I’ve been very busy.
I am meeting Jake tonight for some well needed alone time.
Thanks to some advice from the girls, I’m going to send hubby some feedback before and after sex along with some denial requests.
TBC.

[KinkyBear]

Labels are so complicated. What I am reading in this story doesn’t sound like hotwifing to me. I have been a third for many hotwife couples. One belief I hold is that in a hotwife dynamic, then husband’s desires must be a priority. The relationship is not just with a wife, but with a couple.

I would suggest that what you are dealing with is some evolution of your hotwife dynamic into a polyamorous dynamic. I recently had a very hard time with a relationship that I am in. I have always identified as non-monogamous, but not poly. But I am in a relationship with a woman I love very much, who is poly. Her identification as poly has evolved while we have been together. She believes in a non-hierarchical poly dynamic. I struggle very much with that as I dry much believe in relationship hierarchy.

I threw myself into study of polyamory in an effort to figure out my relationship. I found one podcast particularly helpful. It is called “Making Polyamory Work”. I highly suggest it. Regardless of how you identify or define your relationship, many of the principles are applicable across many dynamics.

I wish you both the best in figuring this out! Your commitment to doing so very much comes through in your writing.

[mrs_reese]

Labels are so complicated. What I am reading in this story doesn’t sound like hotwifing to me. I have been a third for many hotwife couples. One belief I hold is that in a hotwife dynamic, then husband’s desires must be a priority. The relationship is not just with a wife, but with a couple.

I would suggest that what you are dealing with is some evolution of your hotwife dynamic into a polyamorous dynamic. I recently had a very hard time with a relationship that I am in. I have always identified as non-monogamous, but not poly. But I am in a relationship with a woman I love very much, who is poly. Her identification as poly has evolved while we have been together. She believes in a non-hierarchical poly dynamic. I struggle very much with that as I dry much believe in relationship hierarchy.

I threw myself into study of polyamory in an effort to figure out my relationship. I found one podcast particularly helpful. It is called “Making Polyamory Work”. I highly suggest it. Regardless of how you identify or define your relationship, many of the principles are applicable across many dynamics.

I wish you both the best in figuring this out! Your commitment to doing so very much comes through in your writing.

Thank you for sharing this kinky bear
Wonderful post.
And I will listen to the podcast.

Hubby and I are really trying to figure out what’s best for us.

[mrs_reese]

I had my alone time with Jake.
It didn’t go well.
He wants more of me!
And after I talked w hubby Saturday afternoon - but before that talk I was filled with Jake everywhere and after hubby reclaimed me-
It didn’t go well w hubby.
I’m annoyed.
Both men are frustrating me.

[Lookingforadventure]

I had my alone time with Jake.
It didn’t go well.
He wants more of me!
And after I talked w hubby Saturday afternoon - but before that talk I was filled with Jake everywhere and after hubby reclaimed me-
It didn’t go well w hubby.
I’m annoyed.
Both men are frustrating me.

I'm sorry this has been so frustrating for you. Hugs.

Have you taken time, on your own, to figure out what you'd want if you didn't have to consider either man's feelings or wants? Being able to articulate your desires might help you three to find a workable way forward.

[mrs_reese]

I had my alone time with Jake.
It didn’t go well.
He wants more of me!
And after I talked w hubby Saturday afternoon - but before that talk I was filled with Jake everywhere and after hubby reclaimed me-
It didn’t go well w hubby.
I’m annoyed.
Both men are frustrating me.

I'm sorry this has been so frustrating for you. Hugs.

Have you taken time, on your own, to figure out what you'd want if you didn't have to consider either man's feelings or wants? Being able to articulate your desires might help you three to find a workable way forward.

Thank you - resetting this week to figure out a path that works for everyone!
Hubby doesn’t like someone else wanting me too much that it causes friction between us and bf wants more of me for obvious reasons

[veub]

I often read people make the argument that its ok to love more than one person as love is an infinite thing and in a vacuum that is correct. But life is not infinite, time is not infinite and thus a person must ultimately choose who they love the most and allocate their time accordingly. And yes, people could then say time could be divided equally amongst those they love, but then that assumes those that they love are willing to have the person they love equally shared. I don't see Mr Reese being the type who is willing to share his love equally. He seems willing to share only so far as it meets the needs of the game Mr and Mrs Reese have chosen to play together. So though love can be infinite in theory, in true practice, it's just not that simple. I think that is the problem Mrs Reese is running straight into. She seemingly has two men she has now professed to love and need. Ultimately the choices made in life always prove out who and what you love the most. That's what makes affairs of the heart so difficult and scary. You just simply cannot hide behind "I'll love everyone equally" because someone is eventually going to make you choose.

Mrs Reese- unfortunately I think your situation was always headed for this. Viewing it from afar, I think in your effort to make Jake feel comfortable with things you lead him to believe he was somewhat on par with Mr Reese in terms of your priorities. And so with two men believing they're deserving of more of your time and affection, one is going to have to be willing to accept a lesser role or walk away if unwilling. Life's choices are never easy.

[mrs_reese]

I often read people make the argument that its ok to love more than one person as love is an infinite thing and in a vacuum that is correct. But life is not infinite, time is not infinite and thus a person must ultimately choose who they love the most and allocate their time accordingly. And yes, people could then say time could be divided equally amongst those they love, but then that assumes those that they love are willing to have the person they love equally shared. I don't see Mr Reese being the type who is willing to share his love equally. He seems willing to share only so far as it meets the needs of the game Mr and Mrs Reese have chosen to play together. So though love can be infinite in theory, in true practice, it's just not that simple. I think that is the problem Mrs Reese is running straight into. She seemingly has two men she has now professed to love and need. Ultimately the choices made in life always prove out who and what you love the most. That's what makes affairs of the heart so difficult and scary. You just simply cannot hide behind "I'll love everyone equally" because someone is eventually going to make you choose.

Mrs Reese- unfortunately I think your situation was always headed for this. Viewing it from afar, I think in your effort to make Jake feel comfortable with things you lead him to believe he was somewhat on par with Mr Reese in terms of your priorities. And so with two men believing they're deserving of more of your time and affection, one is going to have to be willing to accept a lesser role or walk away if unwilling. Life's choices are never easy.

You’ve been predicting this behavior for a while now!
Thanks for your input as always I really appreciate you
I don’t want to let go of Jake, I feel that want to love both men, but that won’t be possible.
Hubby always owns my heart

[Butterfly411980]

I didn't send that post earlier today. Somebody just copied and pasted my comments from awhile ago. But I do suppose it continues to be the case.
I think LFA made an astute point though yesterday in asking if you thought of what you want out of all this. I can't help but think all the conversations you've had with the men have been you asking them what they want/need from you and then you doing all you can to please them. Have any of the conversations been about what you want/need and what steps they're willing to take to make this better for you and thus everyone?

[veub]

Mrs Reese,
Not mine, but Butterfly's thoughts that were insightful.

[ugcp]

It's certainly okay for people to WANT things. In fact, I'd say it's a good thing. And there's nothing wrong with wants and longing to go unsatisfied... it can actually keep the energy and chemistry intense.

Jake wants more of you? Good. He should want that. And you and Reese should want him to want that. But it doesn't mean a balance actually needs to change. Unless, of course, Jake is saying it isn't a want but is actually a need... that he NEEDS more of you. That can be a no-go, and then it leads to a problem. Frankly, he knows the dynamic already, so I'd not be too happy if he's presenting it as a need or ultimatum.

If it is only a WANT, then great... find ways to have fun with that! Be creative! It means you have a man that simply can't get enough of you, and isn't that ideal? The alternative is that you have a man who has ENOUGH of you... and that obviously doesn't sound nearly as fun lol.

Just like dogs driven by a chase instinct (without much regard for what to do when they actually CATCH), men are often driven by a similar "chase and secure" instinct with romantic relationships. While following that instinct, men can be very impressive (and attractive). That doesn't mean men always need to be granted satisfaction there! Of course he wants to chase you, grab you, and lock you in a tower for his own interests. But if he achieves that, then the chase is over.

[mrs_reese]

I didn't send that post earlier today. Somebody just copied and pasted my comments from awhile ago. But I do suppose it continues to be the case.
I think LFA made an astute point though yesterday in asking if you thought of what you want out of all this. I can't help but think all the conversations you've had with the men have been you asking them what they want/need from you and then you doing all you can to please them. Have any of the conversations been about what you want/need and what steps they're willing to take to make this better for you and thus everyone?

That’s a point well taken it seems to me that I’m always trying to satisfy husband’s fantasies and desires and current potential lovers needs…. Mind you this time with Jake. It’s all about what I wanted.
Somehow, the emphasis has shifted back to what Jake needs most now.
I have to say he is tender and loving and genuine. He’s becoming more needy though, and that’s starting to turn me away from him.

[mrs_reese]

It's certainly okay for people to WANT things. In fact, I'd say it's a good thing. And there's nothing wrong with wants and longing to go unsatisfied... it can actually keep the energy and chemistry intense.

Jake wants more of you? Good. He should want that. And you and Reese should want him to want that. But it doesn't mean a balance actually needs to change. Unless, of course, Jake is saying it isn't a want but is actually a need... that he NEEDS more of you. That can be a no-go, and then it leads to a problem. Frankly, he knows the dynamic already, so I'd not be too happy if he's presenting it as a need or ultimatum.

If it is only a WANT, then great... find ways to have fun with that! Be creative! It means you have a man that simply can't get enough of you, and isn't that ideal? The alternative is that you have a man who has ENOUGH of you... and that obviously doesn't sound nearly as fun lol.

Just like dogs driven by a chase instinct (without much regard for what to do when they actually CATCH), men are often driven by a similar "chase and secure" instinct with romantic relationships. While following that instinct, men can be very impressive (and attractive). That doesn't mean men always need to be granted satisfaction there! Of course he wants to chase you, grab you, and lock you in a tower for his own interests. But if he achieves that, then the chase is over.

This is a very interesting post, and I really appreciate you sharing your point of view with me.
Jake does want me very much. I’m beginning to think that he needs me in his life as well and that is something we’re working on. I’m trying to make him understand that I do not want to replace husband and that even though I love him will always be my number one. I have no desire to replace my hubby is number one.

[ugcp]

Is he posing his wants in terms of:

1. Wanting more of your time and attention, or
2. Wanting your relationship with him to be more committed and serious, or
3. Wanting to replace Reese in the role of your life partner/husband?

The first one is fine and expected.

The second one might be fine, depending on what YOU (and Reese) want... if you want Jake to be a more significant and stable part of your life, then it would be fine. But if you want to keep him as just an occasional source of fun and spice, it might be a problem for him. You'd have to decide (with Reese) what your limit is, and then Jake would need to decide if he can be happy and satisfied with that.

And if it is the last one, then that is a real problem. If I were Reese, in such a situation, I'd be urging you to shut things down because it would be showing disrespect to me and my marriage. It could lead to additional problems if my wife/partner then ignored my feelings because it could suggest a disconnect between us (which is its own serious problem in any non-monogamy configuration).

Whenever I was involved with the wife of a married couple, the wellbeing of the husband and the health of their marriage were extremely important to me. I want my relationship with the wife to enhance all our lives. I get the obvious benefits for myself, the wife gets to feel sexy, desired, excited, naughty, etc, and the husband gets to have a kink satisfied and the almost universal desire of all husbands: the joy of knowing his wife is happy. Everyone should win.

Of course, I've felt the desire for wanting more time and attention from the woman I'm having so much fun with, but I would leave it to her (and her husband) to balance OUR fun with whatever is best for their marriage (and family, life, etc). And because I'm respectful of them, I honour their requests and limits!

Yes, there are always spaces in between when it comes to the nitty gritty of everyday life. I can imagine scenarios such as where the other man is indeed disrespectful of the husband & marriage, and therefore the arrangement cannot last very long, but the sex is good and intense so the wife will keep going until the other man ultimately forces the issue, at which point things end. Not my cup of tea (I prefer things to be stable and sustainable, I guess), but everyone is different and I know that real life doesn't always follow neat and tidy plans.

[mrs_reese]

Is he posing his wants in terms of:

1. Wanting more of your time and attention, or
2. Wanting your relationship with him to be more committed and serious, or
3. Wanting to replace Reese in the role of your life partner/husband?

The first one is fine and expected.

The second one might be fine, depending on what YOU (and Reese) want... if you want Jake to be a more significant and stable part of your life, then it would be fine. But if you want to keep him as just an occasional source of fun and spice, it might be a problem for him. You'd have to decide (with Reese) what your limit is, and then Jake would need to decide if he can be happy and satisfied with that.

And if it is the last one, then that is a real problem. If I were Reese, in such a situation, I'd be urging you to shut things down because it would be showing disrespect to me and my marriage. It could lead to additional problems if my wife/partner then ignored my feelings because it could suggest a disconnect between us (which is its own serious problem in any non-monogamy configuration).

Whenever I was involved with the wife of a married couple, the wellbeing of the husband and the health of their marriage were extremely important to me. I want my relationship with the wife to enhance all our lives. I get the obvious benefits for myself, the wife gets to feel sexy, desired, excited, naughty, etc, and the husband gets to have a kink satisfied and the almost universal desire of all husbands: the joy of knowing his wife is happy. Everyone should win.

Of course, I've felt the desire for wanting more time and attention from the woman I'm having so much fun with, but I would leave it to her (and her husband) to balance OUR fun with whatever is best for their marriage (and family, life, etc). And because I'm respectful of them, I honour their requests and limits!

Yes, there are always spaces in between when it comes to the nitty gritty of everyday life. I can imagine scenarios such as where the other man is indeed disrespectful of the husband & marriage, and therefore the arrangement cannot last very long, but the sex is good and intense so the wife will keep going until the other man ultimately forces the issue, at which point things end. Not my cup of tea (I prefer things to be stable and sustainable, I guess), but everyone is different and I know that real life doesn't always follow neat and tidy plans.

This is really good information
He is requesting more time with me only.
He’s able to not think about my time spent with hubby.
He’s accepted the fact that I’m married and in love with him.
But it’s like he wants me to separate and be two different persons and when I’m with him, I am only for him.
Does that make sense?
I can’t do this.
I still my husbands wife when I am fucking Jake,
I am still married when we are cuddling on the sofa watching a movie.
Do you understand?
I don’t know how to fine him more than I already do,

[ugcp]

Okay, that isn't too bad then. It doesn't sound like a threat to Reese or your marriage, which was my only real concern.

Jake wants the focus of your time together to be focused on your relationship with him, which is kind of understandable in any relationship configuration. For example, when my friend comes over to hang out with me, watch sports, etc, it can be annoying and even rude if he's texting with his new girlfriend. Like.. he JUST was with her, and he will be lesving in an hour or 2, so cannot it not wait until after? Sometimes his girlfriend seems to intentionally phone him during the games about trivial and unimportant things... she knows he's at my place and that we are together, but there is some subconscious (or maybe conscious) effort by her to remind him of HER even when he's not with him ... which I do find to be rude. Not that I'm saying Reese is doing this with you, but maybe Jake feels he can't develop his relationship with you if you and he are never fully alone (physically or mentally).

Yes, of course you're still married while you're with Jake, and you'll never completely forget that fact (similar to being a parent). But it can be frustrating and disruptive to Jake if you're trying to connect together, but your first thought is always about keeping someone else (husband) happy, or always talking about him in conversations. Again, not saying that is the case here, just what feelings might be in play. I only get to hang out with my friend for a couple hours a week, and his gf sees him for hours everyday... can he not give me his entire focus for those 2 hours? Can she not wait those 2 hours before texting him about non urgent things?

Of course, this leaves you feeling pulled in 2 different directions, and torn apart in the process (not in the good way lol).

It's definitely going to be a thing that you 3 will need to work through. Hopefully everyone can also be patient because these things do tend to change over time, and may organically evolve to a more comfortable, or at least acceptable, state.

[Open2it]

I feel sorry for the stress you’re dealing with. The LS is supposed to be fun not a contest of being pulled in two different directions by the two men you are regularly intimate with. Good luck navigating through this.

[mrs_reese]

Is he posing his wants in terms of:

1. Wanting more of your time and attention, or
2. Wanting your relationship with him to be more committed and serious, or
3. Wanting to replace Reese in the role of your life partner/husband?

The first one is fine and expected.

The second one might be fine, depending on what YOU (and Reese) want... if you want Jake to be a more significant and stable part of your life, then it would be fine. But if you want to keep him as just an occasional source of fun and spice, it might be a problem for him. You'd have to decide (with Reese) what your limit is, and then Jake would need to decide if he can be happy and satisfied with that.

And if it is the last one, then that is a real problem. If I were Reese, in such a situation, I'd be urging you to shut things down because it would be showing disrespect to me and my marriage. It could lead to additional problems if my wife/partner then ignored my feelings because it could suggest a disconnect between us (which is its own serious problem in any non-monogamy configuration).

Whenever I was involved with the wife of a married couple, the wellbeing of the husband and the health of their marriage were extremely important to me. I want my relationship with the wife to enhance all our lives. I get the obvious benefits for myself, the wife gets to feel sexy, desired, excited, naughty, etc, and the husband gets to have a kink satisfied and the almost universal desire of all husbands: the joy of knowing his wife is happy. Everyone should win.

Of course, I've felt the desire for wanting more time and attention from the woman I'm having so much fun with, but I would leave it to her (and her husband) to balance OUR fun with whatever is best for their marriage (and family, life, etc). And because I'm respectful of them, I honour their requests and limits!

Yes, there are always spaces in between when it comes to the nitty gritty of everyday life. I can imagine scenarios such as where the other man is indeed disrespectful of the husband & marriage, and therefore the arrangement cannot last very long, but the sex is good and intense so the wife will keep going until the other man ultimately forces the issue, at which point things end. Not my cup of tea (I prefer things to be stable and sustainable, I guess), but everyone is different and I know that real life doesn't always follow neat and tidy plans.

This is really good information
He is requesting more time with me only.
He’s able to not think about my time spent with hubby.
He’s accepted the fact that I’m married and in love with him.
But it’s like he wants me to separate and be two different persons and when I’m with him, I am only for him.
Does that make sense?
I can’t do this.
I still my husbands wife when I am fucking Jake,
I am still married when we are cuddling on the sofa watching a movie.
Do you understand?
I don’t know how to be with him more than I already am.

[mrs_reese]

I feel sorry for the stress you’re dealing with. The LS is supposed to be fun not a contest of being pulled in two different directions by the two men you are regularly intimate with. Good luck navigating through this.

Open2it your always so kind to us.
Thank you

[mrs_reese]

Okay, that isn't too bad then. It doesn't sound like a threat to Reese or your marriage, which was my only real concern.

Jake wants the focus of your time together to be focused on your relationship with him, which is kind of understandable in any relationship configuration. For example, when my friend comes over to hang out with me, watch sports, etc, it can be annoying and even rude if he's texting with his new girlfriend. Like.. he JUST was with her, and he will be lesving in an hour or 2, so cannot it not wait until after? Sometimes his girlfriend seems to intentionally phone him during the games about trivial and unimportant things... she knows he's at my place and that we are together, but there is some subconscious (or maybe conscious) effort by her to remind him of HER even when he's not with him ... which I do find to be rude. Not that I'm saying Reese is doing this with you, but maybe Jake feels he can't develop his relationship with you if you and he are never fully alone (physically or mentally).

Yes, of course you're still married while you're with Jake, and you'll never completely forget that fact (similar to being a parent). But it can be frustrating and disruptive to Jake if you're trying to connect together, but your first thought is always about keeping someone else (husband) happy, or always talking about him in conversations. Again, not saying that is the case here, just what feelings might be in play. I only get to hang out with my friend for a couple hours a week, and his gf sees him for hours everyday... can he not give me his entire focus for those 2 hours? Can she not wait those 2 hours before texting him about non urgent things?

Of course, this leaves you feeling pulled in 2 different directions, and torn apart in the process (not in the good way lol).

It's definitely going to be a thing that you 3 will need to work through. Hopefully everyone can also be patient because these things do tend to change over time, and may organically evolve to a more comfortable, or at least acceptable, state.

Ugcp- and thank you again.
Point well taken.
But it’s really not hubby who is interfering- it’s Jake.
After we have sex, and spend time together a few days have passed he’ll become needy and start texting me telling me he wants to see me and then then if he’s having a few drinks, he becomes very sweet, but some pushy asking me to come over late at night. He deserves more for me, but he is my first priority.
He doesn’t have enough of me at all times, so there’s the love struck angle and wanting to give love and feel love