Encouraging My Wife

[paul80]

Hello!

Long time lurker on the forum.

I am in the process of trying to get my wife to sleep with another man and am looking for help and advice on how to move things forward.

A bit of background:

About 4 years ago, my wife, let's call her J, went though a period of coming home late from work. After speaking to her, it turns out this was completely innocent but at the time I was convinced she was having an affair. At first I went through the usual emotions of jealously and paranoia but the more I churned it over, the more I realised this was a real turn on.

I probably approached the situation wrong to begin with by blurting out my fantasy and pushing too hard, although to my surprise, she never gave me a flat out no, she just seemed a bit confused as to what had changed. I soon realised that trying to push this on my wife was not going to work and neither was it fair. It's either something she wants to do or not. Having said that, this doesn't mean I can't gently encourage her.

Her background is that she had a very religious upbringing, although is not particularly religious now, and didn't experiment sexually much before me. I'm not sure if that works against things or not.

She has recently changed jobs which means she gets out more and meets more people. I'm hopeful that sooner or later she might meet someone that takes her fancy and she'll bring this up in conversation and of course I would encourage her. I did notice messages on her phone from a co-worker which seemed a bit flirty but nothing to get too excited about. I also noticed that when she mentioned him the other day, she seemed to look guilty although I could be reading into this. I also notice that she's been dressing in nicer clothes to work recently. She could just be doing this because she knows I like it or maybe she's feeling a bit more flirty. And she's also been working quite late, coming home at 8pm the other night.

I guess my approach is to encourage her whenever she brings up the topic, which is from time to time. I don't really see what else I can do.

I'm posting this to get help and advice as to how I can progress this.

Thanks.

[armyguyot1]

Welcome to the forum paul80.

[leggysman]

I think it sounds like you've made good steps telling her about your fantasy, but that you need to work on more open communication around these subjects. You shouldn't be wondering what she's thinking, and what she's doing, and you shouldn't need to be reading her communications with others for clues.

If you've been lurking for a while, I'm sure you've seen everyone stressing the importance of communication.

It might take a bit of time, but can you try to get in the habit of talking openly about everything on a regular basis - and perhaps more important - getting her to open up about her fantasies and desires, and what she might or might not be willing to do? Try to make her feel safe; Let her know that you're open to hearing anything, without judgement, and emphasize that you know there's a difference between fantasy, and what someone actually wants to try in real life (desire). These tricky subjects can sometimes be first broached during sexy bedroom talk, but ultimately it's best if you can talk about them matter-of-factly around the breakfast table.

My wife also comes from a conservative religious background, but that didn't stop her from thinking filthy thoughts She just felt guilty about them, when she was young. Not so much anymore!

[paul80]

Thank leggysman for your reply, it's encouraging to get an outside opinion on this and your advice seems sound.

I think it sounds like you've made good steps telling her about your fantasy, but that you need to work on more open communication around these subjects. You shouldn't be wondering what she's thinking, and what she's doing, and you shouldn't need to be reading her communications with others for clues.

Ok, that's encouraging that you think I've made progress in revealing my desires to her, I guess there's a lot of wannabes who are paralysed by this first step. Yes, my wife is very much aware of my fantasy and I keep the topic alive by regularly dropping little comments like "you looked great for work today, do you ever get guys eyeing you up?"

But you're right that I need to instigate more direct conversations. I do however feel I need tread carefully because she can get uncomfortable with such conversations and I don't want it to becomes a no-go area. If I sense she's getting defensive, I need to back-off. This happened with conversations re porn where she felt pressured so I don't want to make the same mistake.

Having said that, there have been a few conversations that have given me hope:

A few months ago I mentioned a dream I'd had about her being a hotwife and she asked "are you up for it then?" I replied yes but I think she suddenly realised I was serious and she retracted.

I also mentioned another dream where she'd been having sex with the neighbour and she said "well sometimes dreams do come true".

A month ago someone asked for her number in the supermarket and I said you should've given it to him. She reacted by saying this made her feel weird but I reassured her that I didn't want her to have a relationship with anyone else, it's just a sex thing.

A while back I asked her if she ever gets turned on by anyone other than me and she said of course I do, I'm a woman with desires.

So all these things make me believe that she has the desire and if I navigate this right, she'll do it. Or maybe she's just humouring me?!

Assuming she dresses nice for work tomorrow, I was thinking of asking if it's because she likes my reaction or if she's getting some attention at work? I would react by saying that if she wants to flirt i'm completely cool with this.

It might take a bit of time, but can you try to get in the habit of talking openly about everything on a regular basis

Yes, you're right and I've started to implement this by listening more attentively to her without criticism.

and perhaps more important - getting her to open up about her fantasies and desires, and what she might or might not be willing to do? Try to make her feel safe; Let her know that you're open to hearing anything, without judgement, and emphasize that you know there's a difference between fantasy, and what someone actually wants to try in real life (desire). These tricky subjects can sometimes be first broached during sexy bedroom talk, but ultimately it's best if you can talk about them matter-of-factly around the breakfast table.

So we've always had lots of fantasies in our sex life and she enjoys this, and she's commented how she doesn't feel judged by me. I've never shunned her for any of her desires.

My wife also comes from a conservative religious background, but that didn't stop her from thinking filthy thoughts She just felt guilty about them, when she was young. Not so much anymore!

Ok, that's encouraging

[2inUPMichigan]

I wouldn't assume too much from her change in clothing because, as you said, she just changed jobs. We women at times use clothes in work settings as armor or to fit in when in a new situation, unfortunate but true.

When you talk about hotwifing, try to think about it from her side, then ask questions from that perspective. The questions you asked or the comments you made were all from your point of view (what turns you on). What do you think the benefits would be for her? (and please don't say sex) If you don't know the answer, start reading the threads written by our VHW'S.

Do you know the process that many women go through to decide if this is the right path for them? Are you familiar with some of the most common barriers?

Wanting sex is a simple answer, but it isn't necessarily the key to determining if a woman will decide to be a hotwife.

[paul80]

I wouldn't assume too much from her change in clothing because, as you said, she just changed jobs.

In the end I asked her directly about her up-dressing for work and she said she is just fitting in and it is nothing so exciting as flirting. I asked her if flirting with other men excites her as it most definitely excites me to which I got no response. Sometimes she'll do this, ignore my comment, although she's never explicitly say no.

What do you think the benefits would be for her?

You're right that I may be focusing too much on my wants and not appreciating hers enough. I'm aware that she has to see the benefits if she's to move forward. I would say that it would enhance our relationship by adding excitement and opening up communication, and she would likely revel in her new found confidence. She would also have the benefits of a stable long-term partner whilst having the excitement of some short-term play.

Do you know the process that many women go through to decide if this is the right path for them? Are you familiar with some of the most common barriers?

She once said that it made her feel weird that I would want her to be with another man and I explained that I definitely didn't want her to run off with someone else but only to have some fun on the side. She said she was glad to hear this.

She's also said that we're married, we've made a commitment to be monogamous and she doesn't agree with infidelity to which I replied that I didn't think it would be cheating if both of us agree, and everything is open and discussed.

I assured her right from the beginning that I have no interest in opening things up on my side and this never seems to be a concern for her.

What other concerns might I be missing?

As per leggysman's advice, I've continued to listen to her attentively without interruption or judgement.

The other day she mentioned that she sometimes gives one of her single male co-workers lifts in her car (work related) and although it's nothing to get excited about, I'm happy that she's comfortable to reveal this. I of course teased her to remind her that I find this exciting.

I also said to her yesterday that she has a great ass and she must get other guys looking at it. She said probably and that she looks at other guys asses. Again I'm happy that she revealed this and it shows her eyes do wonder.

She mentioned the other day that she's interested in starting ball-room dancing again, which she loves and used to do years ago. This would involve dancing with other guys so I think it's a good opportunity for her to get comfortable with other men. I need to encourage this further but don't want to make a thing out of it.

[armyguyot1]

Best if you let it happen and rather than cause it to happen. It should be her idea with you as her person to blame if anything goes wrong. Ballroom dancing has got to be a good place for you. She knows what you are interested in and the ballroom is a good place to watch it expand.

[paul80]

Ballroom dancing has got to be a good place for you. She knows what you are interested in and the ballroom is a good place to watch it expand.

Yes, I think dancing is an ideal opportunity. If it comes up in conversation, I was going to be completely transparent that the idea of her dancing with other guys excites me.

Minor update: The wife mentioned a guy at work who's leaving, she spoke a fair bit about him, how he's articulate and funny. We hugged and she noticed I was hard. She said: it's because we've been talking about my co-worker, isn't it? I agreed and this opened up a conversation. She said most guys would get jealous and I explained that I just really like the idea of her being pleasured. I asked if she found this weird and she replied a bit, which was a much milder reaction to when we've discussed previously.

Although small, I feel this is progress because the conversation felt more normal and matter-of-fact, without strong emotions getting in the way.

She also mentioned someone at work she finds attractive, so again, I'm happy that she feels comfortable to mention this.

I think I just need to keep doing what I'm doing: discuss openly when the opportunity arises and encourage her when she mentions someone she likes. What do others think?

[superb101]

The very fact she is communicating her feelings and you are listening, encouraging and responding in a positive way to her is huge.

[leggysman]

I think I just need to keep doing what I'm doing: discuss openly when the opportunity arises and encourage her when she mentions someone she likes. What do others think?

Exactly right, IMO. When things come up naturally, that's the right time to encourage her. The rest of the time, just let it sit with her. That's how to avoid being pushy. It takes patience, but I think that's usually the right way to go.

[2inUPMichigan]

I think I just need to keep doing what I'm doing: discuss openly when the opportunity arises and encourage her when she mentions someone she likes. What do others think?

Exactly right, IMO. When things come up naturally, that's the right time to encourage her. The rest of the time, just let it sit with her. That's how to avoid being pushy. It takes patience, but I think that's usually the right way to go.

I agree!
This made it easier for me. Hubby was patient and made himself available whenever I had questions or concerns that I needed to discuss. He would stop what he was doing and be present in the conversation.

It was a judgment free zone for both of us during those talks. We both out aside our preconceived ideas and really heard each other That led to lighthearted comments and teasing as we moved further down our path towards that big step!

[paul80]

So since my last post about 3 weeks ago, nothing much had happened but then yesterday, I was playing with her when she told me how her ex-boyfriend used to do the same thing. Then she said how some guy had chatted her up at the bus-stop earlier and she knows she can tell me because I don't get jealous. I asked her if she was just humouring me but she assured me she had indeed been chatted up and she had flirted back.

I find myself getting flummoxed in these situations, even though it was the ideal opportunity to open up a conversation, and just said something benign like, wow, that's amazing! I followed up with a text saying how it's great that she got chatted up and I'm totally cool with her to flirting back.

When there isn't any progress for a while, I find myself despairing and questioning whether this will ever happen. But then moments like this give me renewed hope.

What do people think?

[paul80]

So today, out of the blue, she said she'd seen a picture of a male stripper, with a thong on, and she doesn't find 'the whole package' attractive. She affirmed that she only likes me. I asked if she would ever want another guy's cock and she said no.

This felt pretty gutting because in all the years I've been trying to encourage her, she's never given me a direct no.

I later said that i didn't know she was into pictures of strippers to which she fumbled and said she'd seen one on a billboard. I laughed and it was clear she'd been browsing on the internet, which i didn't think she was into.

So in a way, it feels like she'd been browsing and considering how she would feel with another man. She even admitted in a previous conversation that she sometimes gets wet when she sees someone attractive.

I'm really not sure where to go from here. I don't think i can accept no, i have to keep in trying. I find it difficult to talk face to face about this so i was going to write her a text saying that I'd been thinking about our conversation and I'm glad she's devoted to me and this is the reason i am able to entertain the idea of her having fun.

Advice please!

[superb101]

In a quiet moment, ask her where she saw the pic. If it was on the internet, ask her if you two can look at it together sometime, that you would love to know what makes her wet (assume it did just for the sake of conversation) and tell her you want to see what else excites her because, tell her, that if it excites her, it will definitely excite you knowing it turns her own. Conversations like this "move the ball down the field". Seeing and knowing what things get her turned on might help. IMHO

[paul80]

Thanks superb101, i think asking her where she saw the picture and seeing if we can view it together is a good idea and could open some doors. She's quite uptight about porn so i was surprised and pleased that she'd looked at such an image. It shows her mind is wandering at least.

This morning she told me of a dream she had last night where she was dressed in lingerie, really tarted up and was looking in a mirror. But in the dream she was thinking, this isn't me. She said she was in a small room with a window and it felt that people were looking in.

I like hearing about her dreams and analysed that maybe she was playing with erotic ideas but was worried about being judged. She commented that I'm always very attentive to her sex dreams. I find them a good way of opening up conversation on the topic and reaffirming my desires to her.

Even though she wasn't comfortable with her image in her dream, at least it shows she's mulling things over.

Any advice of how to proceed very much welcome.

[superb101]

Keep listening. Keep asking follow up questions! Follow up questions mean you are listening and attentive to what she is saying, that you care where the conversation is heading and that she is leading the way with her insight and feelings. When she is talking, she is believing and "buying in". When you are talking, you potentially are pressuring. Big, big difference.

[whosbeensleeping]

Thanks superb101, i think asking her where she saw the picture and seeing if we can view it together is a good idea and could open some doors. She's quite uptight about porn so i was surprised and pleased that she'd looked at such an image. It shows her mind is wandering at least.

This morning she told me of a dream she had last night where she was dressed in lingerie, really tarted up and was looking in a mirror. But in the dream she was thinking, this isn't me. She said she was in a small room with a window and it felt that people were looking in.

I like hearing about her dreams and analysed that maybe she was playing with erotic ideas but was worried about being judged. She commented that I'm always very attentive to her sex dreams. I find them a good way of opening up conversation on the topic and reaffirming my desires to her.

Even though she wasn't comfortable with her image in her dream, at least it shows she's mulling things over.

Any advice of how to proceed very much welcome.

I can relate do much to your struggles. I do think you're right on with your analysis of the dream.

[D_Lited_HubWife]

Thanks superb101, i think asking her where she saw the picture and seeing if we can view it together is a good idea and could open some doors. She's quite uptight about porn so i was surprised and pleased that she'd looked at such an image. It shows her mind is wandering at least.

This morning she told me of a dream she had last night where she was dressed in lingerie, really tarted up and was looking in a mirror. But in the dream she was thinking, this isn't me. She said she was in a small room with a window and it felt that people were looking in.

I like hearing about her dreams and analysed that maybe she was playing with erotic ideas but was worried about being judged. She commented that I'm always very attentive to her sex dreams. I find them a good way of opening up conversation on the topic and reaffirming my desires to her.

Even though she wasn't comfortable with her image in her dream, at least it shows she's mulling things over.

Any advice of how to proceed very much welcome.

Does she remember her dreams often? Or was this kind of an out of blue thing like something was special about it?

I will say, the biggest thing that she can get from you early on is confidence. She needs to know that your love is unwavering and that you will be by her side and have her back. Because, from experience, her way of going about the action of the lifestyle may be different than how you envision it.

[Her number1]

I will say, the biggest thing that she can get from you early on is confidence. She needs to know that your love is unwavering and that you will be by her side and have her back. Because, from experience, her way of going about the action of the lifestyle may be different than how you envision it.

Very well said!

[Pufferfish]

I always pay attention when people talk about their "dreams" especially sex dreams. Not because I derive any special meaning from dreams, personally I think that people are full of shit when talking about their dreams 80% of the time. Most of the time, especially in regards to hotwifing, people use dreams as a means of talking about a subject in a way that won't incriminate themselves. Like, instead of "It would be the sexiest thing ever if I watched you have sex with another man." They'll breach the topic like, "I had a weird dream last night... I was stuck in a chair and couldn't move and you were having sex with someone in front of me." But it was just a dream, I can't control it and it's not my fault if you're mad...

So when someone is talking about a sex dream, my first thought is, "what are they actually trying to say?" Maybe I'm wrong, or cynical, but I usually only remember a small handful of dreams a year, and they rarely ever have any significance to my life.

[aztd]

Following

[PaNic]

Wanting sex is a simple answer, but it isn't necessarily the key to determining if a woman will decide to be a hotwife.

Please, please Ms. Michigan, do tell us wannabes what is the key???

[philxxo]

I think there is a lot of promise in this story. I think it will eventually pay off and you will be rewarded in the end. She is definitely considering it in her mind.

[paul80]

Most of the time, especially in regards to hotwifing, people use dreams as a means of talking about a subject in a way that won't incriminate themselves.

Yes, I totally agree and I've done the same myself to gauge her reaction. e.g. I've told her I've had a dream about some guy cracking onto her and how I woke up with a boner, etc. So it's always at the back of my mind that when she tells me of some sex dream, she may be testing me.

She brought up a conversation the other day about how she finds lean men attractive and fancies a particular actor off TV. Then a couple of days later mentioned she'd had a dream about him. Like you say, she could just be testing me but that's fine, it shows she wants to bring up the conversation. And if it is a genuine dream then perhaps she has deeper desires

Does she remember her dreams often? Or was this kind of an out of blue thing like something was special about it?

She does remember a lot of dreams. Most of them are benign but occasionally there's a spicy one which is always a good conversation starter.

I will say, the biggest thing that she can get from you early on is confidence. She needs to know that your love is unwavering and that you will be by her side and have her back.

The other day she randomly told me about an experience she'd had in a shared dorm in a hostel where the guy in the top bunk started jerking off. She said she'd felt threatened by this and wanted to know if this was normal / acceptable behaviour for men. I wondered if she was testing me to make sure I would have her back in such a scenario. I reassured her that that her feelings were valid and I wish I could've been there to protect her.

We got into a conversation a few weeks ago about how she doesn't feel as sexy as she used to. I openly admitted that I like to encourage her to dress up (of which there has been definite progress here) because I believe it'll make her feel more sexy, and she agreed that it does. I went on to say that one of the reasons I encourage her to flirt with other men is because I believe it would boost her confidence. She asked why I want her to run off with another guy (which she has queried before) and I reiterated that I would definitely not want her to run off with somebody else, only to have sex. Hopefully that message is slowly getting through.

I think there is a lot of promise in this story. I think it will eventually pay off and you will be rewarded in the end. She is definitely considering it in her mind.

Yes, I think she is considering it and I do believe that with persistence, she will eventually do it. Or maybe I'm delusional!!

[paul80]

Haven't posted for a while. I've kinda resigned myself to it not happening and backed off the topic unless she raises it.

Interesting the other day though she said that i wasn't her first sexual partner but i might be her last. I said "might?" Felt like she made a Freudian slip but maybe I'm reading too much into it.

She also showed me a video the other day of her driving at work with a black male colleague in the car. Again, probably nothing but maybe she was testing my reaction.